Host Engineering Forum
General Category => Do-more CPUs and Do-more Designer Software => Topic started by: jwbaker3 on October 29, 2018, 09:31:34 AM
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Is there a way to do a offline setup of the IP address of the onboard CPU Ethernet port?
Thanks,
JW
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You can do it in your program with SETUPIP
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Thanks that is what I though, just hoping it was like some of the other brands that can be setup in the configuration off line.
JW
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Since the Ethernet port is the primary programming port for roughly 2/3rd of the systems out there, we never considered including the Ethernet port setup as part of the System Config. It's a little tricky, because for the majority of the systems that are using as it a programming port, you don't want the system config overriding what was already externally configured. Since Host came to the PLC world via Ethernet modules, it just never crossed our mind to do it that way....however...
This is a request that we have gotten several times and it is something we plan to add in the future. Just gotta figure out what the rules are. It's exactly like programming over serial and then writing a program the re-purposes the serial. The one difference is that there isn't an external utility to configure the serial port...although we did add a DIP switch that would force the serial port back into programming mode, just to fix the situation that this causes. We have talked about making the IP config optional, and if you turn it on and break the Ethernet port, 'too bad, so sad". There is always the magic handshake to get your unit back. ;)
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I would even be happy with being able to set the IP address simply as a form of documentation.
It seems wrong to have to open the HMI config to find out what the PLC's IP address is.
Host isn't the only one that is missing this info while offline.
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I would even be happy with being able to set the IP address simply as a form of documentation.
It seems wrong to have to open the HMI config to find out what the PLC's IP address is.
Host isn't the only one that is missing this info while offline.
I think the issue here is that a PLC's Ethernet port can be used as server and/or a client. Depending on what you are using the port for greatly affects where it should be set and the significance of the IP address (or lack of). What is the IP address of your PC? Who cares. But what is the IP address of a critical server? I don't know the IP, but I do know the name that gets resolved to it.
Our introduction to automation hardware was the ECOM. Where is the offline config for it? There isn't one. Since ECOMs can be server or client, DHCP and static IP may make sense or not, but the config is always online. Since we had no hope of getting help from the PLC to configure the ECOM, we built NetEdit, and that became our focus for all Ethernet setup everywhere.
When we built out first PLC, it honestly never crossed our mind to put the IP address in the system config, since nearly every PLC at Host uses the Ethernet port as the programming port. When we first started hearing this request, we scratched our head...we had no idea why you would want it. I'm still a little fuzzy on it, but I guess when you are using the PLC's port strictly as a client, it would make sense to add the config to the system config. And we will.
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It would be useful for simple dump and run situations when downloading using a USB POM.
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Or any POM, including the Ethernet one. If you have two Ethernet ports, it's a good bet at least one of them isn't for programming, and most likely the internal one.
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I would even be happy with being able to set the IP address simply as a form of documentation.
I think the issue here is that a PLC's Ethernet port can be used as server and/or a client. Depending on what you are using the port for greatly affects where it should be set and the significance of the IP address (or lack of). What is the IP address of your PC? Who cares. But what is the IP address of a critical server? I don't know the IP, but I do know the name that gets resolved to it.
I think you are assuming there is a router? (I am not network savvy.) Most Do-more, C-more, VFD or DC Drive systems I do have no router, just a switch or even a single patch cable. C-more requires me to enter an IP for the PLC I want to access, hence I need to know it and it has to stay the same. I need to know what IP addresses are open before I configure my PC IP and plug into a local system switch just so I don't walk all over something else. At least this is what I think I need to do.
So my quote above was simply for a place to RECORD the IP the PLC has been set to so I can open the program offline and see what it should be. I would have to stick that in there manually, but there would be a defined note field just for that. A generic note doesn't have a particular place someone would know to look.
But actually configuring it in the offline would be sweet.
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No, not suggesting a router. We just know that the majority of users use Ethernet for programming, so the Ethernet has to be set outside the program. It has been a recurrent request from ADC tech support to set the address offline, which obviously has to be part of the project.
Hadn't thought about strictly documentation, but adding to the project should satisfy both needs.
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I don't have an issue with the current method, but I suppose you could build the process from NetEdit into DMD, so that the first thing it does upon going online is look for a matching CPU, and if it doesn't find one, go to Ethernet config using the same UI as NetEdit, then automagically cuts over to DMD and initiates a program download.
It's really doing the same thing, but it might feel more integrated, plus the config could be stored in the project and set offline.
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I don't have an issue with the current method, but I suppose you could build the process from NetEdit into DMD, so that the first thing it does upon going online is look for a matching CPU, and if it doesn't find one, go to Ethernet config using the same UI as NetEdit, then automagically cuts over to DMD and initiates a program download.
It's really doing the same thing, but it might feel more integrated, plus the config could be stored in the project and set offline.
We are well into doing exactly that. NetEdit won't be required for PLCs soon, and the process will be much cleaner.
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I hate to say it but I like how CLICK software connects. Under PLC> Connect a box opens up. I like how that works. Is this something everyone is talking about as far as connecting offline?
I use the Do-More Ethernet port to connect to my HMI and programming. I do NOT use the same port for programming and HMI for external I/O.
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I hate to say it but I like how CLICK software connects. Under PLC> Connect a box opens up. I like how that works. Is this something everyone is talking about as far as connecting offline?
No. The discussion is about how an IP address configuration gets into the PLC. We have had multiple requests to include that configuration as part of the project, rather than requiring you to use NetEdit. We're adding that.
As for connecting...we are well into a rework of our connect mechanism, which will make it much more like Click/PxK. You'll select Connect, and then be presented with a very smart dialog that will walk you through everything. It could be as simple as picking an existing link (which we are renaming 'Connection') or selecting from all the hardware we found (scanning all ports). If you select an Ethernet device which isn't already configured, we scan the network to see which IP addresses are already in use and then recommend an address and allow you to configure the CPU.
This part isn't coded yet, but there will also be a troubleshooter where we help you based on the port you tell us the PLC is connected to.
And relax IT guys...we aren't actually 'scanning' the network, we're reading the ARP table.
Maybe Franj will be nice an post a screenshot of where we are going...
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I have a few connections, but a couple of "new" PLCs that are in the building that do not have any defined "Connections" in my Designer installation (see first screen shot).
If I double click on one of my defined Connections, it connects to that PLC.
If I attempt to connect to a "new" PLC that HAS an IP Configuration, I will be prompted to give the Connection a name (and optional Description), and it will create that Connection then connect to that PLC (see 2nd screen shot).
If I attempt to connect to a "new" PLC that does NOT have an IP Configuration, I will be prompted to configure the IP settings (see 3rd screen shot). This scenario is a typical "out of box" experience (at least with an Ethernet model).
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Looks nice. The "other/description" column, is that something that is defined in the CPU configuration?
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The "other/description" column, is that something that is defined in the CPU configuration?
No. That's just notes based off the Connection definition. For example, is the IP Address undefined. Or are you using Module ID for the Address Mode - we recommend IP Address. Module ID is so 1997.
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Could you add a CPU name in the configuration and have it listed in the link table? That way you could look in the list and pick the correct link by CPU name. The link doesn't depend on it, that still goes by IP address. DMD reads it from the system area. It would make it user friendly for networks with many CPU's. I know you are very busy at the moment, but maybe add it to the wish list?
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Could you add a CPU name in the configuration and have it listed in the link table? That way you could look in the list and pick the correct link by CPU name. The link doesn't depend on it, that still goes by IP address. DMD reads it from the system area. It would make it user friendly for networks with many CPU's. I know you are very busy at the moment, but maybe add it to the wish list?
Is the Connection (Link) too general purpose, e.g. you use the same USB Link for multiple projects?
The name of the Project file name may be available - not sure. We'll see.
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Yeah, the link setups don't normally get saved to the archiving server locations and sometimes it may be USB. Project name could be very useful especially if they do like there are supposed to and incorporate a Rev level in the name. I like that.
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The two main reasons why I asked:1 A lot of the time we program for OEM's and never see the PLC, unless there is a problem with the program. So we have to train the equipment builder to make sure to set the IP after the machine is built, before it is shipped to the customer so we don't have to buy a plane ticket to set a IP for a mad customer. 2 Our Allen Bradley and Siemens guys rub it in our face that their preferred PLC will do this. Also if we are setting up a system with a lot of ethernet equipment it is nice to have it downloaded to the plc with the program so we don't have to go back to each processor and set the IP address. The field guy has to have a list of the addresses and more chance for mistakes. I understand that ethernet can be used for more than programming and comm's to the touch screen, but I know other brands allow us to do all of the comm port's setups (including ethernet) with the programming software offline when we write the program and it is downloaded to the processor with the program.
JW
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The two main reasons why I asked:1 A lot of the time we program for OEM's and never see the PLC, unless there is a problem with the program. So we have to train the equipment builder to make sure to set the IP after the machine is built, before it is shipped to the customer so we don't have to buy a plane ticket to set a IP for a mad customer. 2 Our Allen Bradley and Siemens guys rub it in our face that their preferred PLC will do this. Also if we are setting up a system with a lot of ethernet equipment it is nice to have it downloaded to the plc with the program so we don't have to go back to each processor and set the IP address. The field guy has to have a list of the addresses and more chance for mistakes. I understand that ethernet can be used for more than programming and comm's to the touch screen, but I know other brands allow us to do all of the comm port's setups (including ethernet) with the programming software offline when we write the program and it is downloaded to the processor with the program.
JW
All ports can be changed by the program, programs can be changed offline, therefore all ports can be changed offline. But yes, we can and will do a bit better with that in regards to the Ethernet port.
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Thanks, I am still in the Do More camp so any improvement would be great. I am still the AB and Siemens programmers boss at our company so they cant get rowdy or I'll give them a Modicon M221 project.
JW
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Careful -- in some states I think Modicon's considered criminal harassment! Certainly any state I'm governor of. ;D
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Is that the "con" in Modicon?