Host Engineering Forum
General Category => Do-more CPUs and Do-more Designer Software => Topic started by: deep6ixed on November 15, 2016, 07:19:02 PM
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Hi Guys,
Just got done with my project with the P2k with a VFD and you guys brought up the capacity of the new Do-More, was looking at SCADA on some of our older equipment.
Without trying to pry in to much detail, would the new Do-More come in at a similar price range to the Click with ethernet ($139), I'm in need of a simple device that can take some I/O, do a little magic and let me access it via modbus.
What I want to do works great on the Do-More sim, and if the price point is around the same, I'll then see on a time frame of when we want to do this.
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Hi Guys,
Just got done with my project with the P2k with a VFD and you guys brought up the capacity of the new Do-More, was looking at SCADA on some of our older equipment.
Without trying to pry in to much detail, would the new Do-More come in at a similar price range to the Click with ethernet ($139), I'm in need of a simple device that can take some I/O, do a little magic and let me access it via modbus.
What I want to do works great on the Do-More sim, and if the price point is around the same, I'll then see on a time frame of when we want to do this.
The new hardware are full Do-more CPUs, with some very powerful new features that aren't in the existing CPUs, so they are definitely going to cost more than Click. Without going into detail, the starting price of the 10 I/O unit is $199, 18 I/O is $249, and 36 I/O is $299...and they would make nice Valentine's Day gifts for that special someone. ;)
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Would I be correct in assuming that the unit also includes on board Ethernet?
On a side note, we plan to upgrade our machines that use the D240, Looks like its time to move them to the Do-more and out of the stone age.
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Sorry, no. There is a second tier of units that include Ethernet and analog I/O. They are a bit higher than the bottom tier, although less than the cost of an H2-DM1E. Compared to the cost of a similarly equipped DL06, these units range from comparable to much less, depending on how the DL06 was optioned.
We will never compete with Click on price with this class of processor. My guess is that FPGA we use costs more than the entire BOM of a Click, but of course Click will never compete with Do-more on feature set. I do think that the lower price can be a false savings though, for anything but the simplest applications. Engineering time will rapidly surpass the savings.
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And a $100 difference vanishes quick if you factor in engineering time, spare logic capacity for future additions, and all the other Do-More advantages that might help with your application. Being able to avoid the dorky Click software -- priceless!
And we're talking $100 here, not $10K. I'd never even consider a Click unless it were for a product line where I expected to ship 1000 units and all you had to do per unit was load it, OR just using it as passive Modbus RTU or TCP I/O.
Trying to save component money with engineering labor is a fool's errand unless there are a LOT of identical or near-identical units.
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And we're talking $100 here, not $10K. I'd never even consider a Click unless it were for a product line where I expected to ship 1000 units and all you had to do per unit was load it, OR just using it as passive Modbus RTU or TCP I/O.
That's exactly the plan. We intend to use a low end PLC to take the various machine signals to generate 3 or 4 "states" that our SCADA software could use. Use them as a 'black box' per say to let our Maintenance Server know what is going on.
For example, one our welders needs to be in Automatic Mode, Pumps Running, Machine Enabled and the Speed Control Lever not at Zero to be considered producing. But the loop comes from the fact you can have any one of those conditions met at any time. We plan to use the PLC to take the input signals and figure out if the machine is running, and by counting shaft RPM, at what speed.
The other design rule we are using for this project is that the PLC is read only for production machines. The supervisor couldn't stop the machine from his office or anything like that.
The thought came from our boss wanting status lights in each of the main offices that would give machine status. Weidmeuller came in with a $2500 per machine solution. That would give us just lights... I said why not just use SCADA software running on our server and tie in a black box on each machine to act as semi passive IO. Each machine has an ethernet port near the operator's console to run our ERM clients. Just tie into that connection. Anyone in the plant could see what was running and what speeds. Then we could add the ability to page maintenance and ETC...
Right now, I'm in the costing phase, looking at what all the options are. I've looked at the ProtosX, which wouldn't allow me to preprocess the signals, the click which is limited on what it can do, and the do-more.
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This might be a slight wobbler, but I think you're already beyond what I'd have considered passive I/O. For me, I'd probably be using a Do-More for this type application, unless there's 30 of the machines to monitor or something.
I mean, bear in mind, I'm ALREADY thinking of Do-More as the low-cost / high bang-per-buck solution, vs other PLC's I might use. You can even get Siemens S7-1200s starting in the $200-300 range (including Ethernet!), so unless your needs are VERY minimal, it's going to be really hard for a Click to come out as best-in-class.
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Currently looking at adding about 20 machines to the network. 4 of which would get Do-more units as they are slated to get upgraded within next two years. I can build the function into the new design.
On these systems, at 20 stations i have other costs i have to figure in. Quite a few need hubs installed, and like anything accounting gets involved and suddenly i have to fight for every penny. They seem to only like B.I.F.F projects. (Big Improvements For Free)
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deep6ixed...you have a PM.
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[quote they would make nice Valentine's Day gifts for that special someone. ][/quote] Is that safe to assume not for Christmas?
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author=amos link=topic=1903.msg16011#msg16011 date=1479439238]
they would make nice Valentine's Day gifts for that special someone. ]
Is that safe to assume not for Christmas?
This is at the core of why we don't announce release dates...stuff happens and we don't want to disappoint folks. The original target release date was mid December, but the heavy documentation load simply made that unachievable. As of this moment, we feel very good about a date near that other holiday.
We think it'll be worth the wait though. This is a very nice addition to the Do-more line.
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Oh goody! I can give one to my wife for our 36th anniversary, which happens to be Valentines day. She's returned every present I have ever given her. At least I'll have use for this one.
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My wife would open it looking for jewelry...
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Well, it does Do More, but I think jewelry is probably too much to ask! ;)
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Well, it does Do More, but I think jewelry is probably too much to ask! ;)
Jewelry is pretty, but a well controlled machine is truly sexy.
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True! And I bet there actually is some gold and possibly palladium in there anyway!